Jackson Racing Supercharger R18 9TH gen?

Discussion in 'Coupe & Sedan (Non-Si)' started by Kylesn52, Nov 24, 2016.

  1. Kylesn52

    Kylesn52 Member

    Messages:
    9
    Location:
    Toronto Ontario
    Vehicle Model:
    EX
    Body Style:
    Sedan
    Hey guys. I have owned my car for about 6 months and love it. Its not an SI, but I didn't originally buy it with power in mind. I commute to work and school so fuel economy is important to me. I am looking for a way to get more power now though. In the past I wasn't aware that there was an easy tuning solution in place for the 9th gen R18. I found the hondata flash pro recently and it has opened some doors. I see that Jackson Racing has a Supercharger kit for the R18 motor but I'm curious as to how well it bolts up onto the 9th gen R18. I have seen some people saying that it will take substantial fabrication work to make it fit the 9th gen as opposed to the 8th gen because of the engine bay lay out. Does anyone have any experience with this kit on a 9th gen? The "factory tuned" system looks like a good option. It seems that the only difference between the "factory tune" and "track tune" version is the tune and size of the injectors. (a difference of +65hp to +100hp). If this kit fits the 9th gen r18 as easily as the 8th gen R18 I am seriously interested. What I don't want is to have to spend weeks fabricating piping and things as this is my daily driver. (not to mention the added cost and headaches) Thanks!
     
  2. webby
    • Staff
    • 2019 Toys For Tots

    webby Administrator

    Messages:
    51,587
    It's not a direct bolt on. If I recall correctly, I think they've said the crash beam on the 9th is the issue. Due to that, the piping from the 8th won't work for the intercooler and whatnot. @Nix has done a number of posts about it. Maybe he can copy/link you.

    I've not seen a single person try to fabricate new piping to make it work.
     
  3. Nix

    Nix Jötunn Moderator

    Messages:
    10,765
    Location:
    Lew-vul, KY
    Body Style:
    It's A Fast Pig!
    post for remember to reply.....
     
  4. Nix

    Nix Jötunn Moderator

    Messages:
    10,765
    Location:
    Lew-vul, KY
    Body Style:
    It's A Fast Pig!
    Allright so you want to look into the JR supercharger for your R18?

    Well, first off do you have an AT or Manual?

    I had emailed JR quite a while ago so it may be worth asking them again but from what I remember the regular base version will fit either car easily. The track pack is the one that comes with an intercooler. The kit for the AT does not include the intercooler as the transmission sticks out too far and they couldn't run the pipes easily enough. So the AT cars are limited to the 65hp base kit. Both kits come with upgraded injectors. This may have changed. The base kit was built around all stock parts as well so you don't have to upgrade anything to get that power bump. That said, AT R18's usually dyno around 110-115hp at the wheels so with the 65hp increase you end up around 170-180hp at the wheels, from the dyno charts I've seen, which is stock Si territory.

    The TIY kit means you have to buy flash pro and new injectors yourself and get someone to tune the car for you.

    The factory tune means they send you a locked tune and upgraded injectors. I can't remember exactly but I think you have to send in your ECU and they flash a tune onto it for you. It's a very safe tune and should give you tons of trouble free miles.

    The "track" package came with a very aggressive tune and an intercooler. The IC does not fit the AT cars from what I remember.

    The 06-11 and 2012+ R18 motors are almost identical. There is a little difference in the mounts, oil pan, and the front crash beam since the hood/grill/lights/design of the car is different. That said, the base kit should bolt right up without issue. It's possible that the crash bar in front would need to be trimmed to fit the rotrex unit but I don't know for certain. You could possibly just need to notch the beam where the blower is and the piping might just clear the rest.


    I believe the reason JR won't say it fits a 9th gen is because they have not personally test fit the system on a 2012+ car. Also flash pro took so long to come out for the non-Si 2012+ cars and their sales of R18 kits were so low anyways, they didn't put the time into test fitting it. They do like to sell a kit that doesn't require any custom fabrication and I don't blame them.

    The main reason people shy away from this kit is that the cost to upgrade is usually close to the cost of trading in & putting the $5k of supercharger money towards an Si. I was going to get one but it ended up costing more to do the SC kit than to trade up to a different car. Not trying to talk you out of it but you will need more than the kit alone to get what you want out of the SC kit. If you start making a ton more power, you're going to need better tires and suspension to put that power down and not just spin the wheels. The SI comes with an LSD and the R18 does not, so that power can easily just be put into tire smoke.




    Example:
    I put in a 2013 Civic EX Sedan into KBB with 75,000 miles and very good condition:

    Trade in value is around $8500 and selling private party sale is around $10k.
    http://www.kbb.com/honda/civic/2013...=75000&pricetype=trade-in&condition=very-good


    2012/13 SI cars with between 40-60,000 miles are on carmax, which is always priced high, for around $15,000.

    Here is a 2012 Si with 40,000 miles for $15,600
    https://www.carmax.com/cars/honda/civic/2012/13730458



    If you sold your car for $10k and had the $5k of supercharger money, you could potentially trade in for a car with less miles and all the upgrades including the power you want. So, even if you trade in for let's say $9k, you are still within $1-2k of the Si price vs putting the supercharger on your car. You could certainly find a 12/13 Si for less than what carmax has, they are just always high so it gives a good reference point as far as values go. Unless you have to have an automatic, then the Si is of course not an option.



    Have you done anything performance wise to your car yet? Other than cosmetic stuff? I would highly suggest looking into a few choice mods first that can really transform the car before going full on SC kit.
     
  5. Tak

    Tak Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    615
    Location:
    New York City
    Vehicle Model:
    LX
    Body Style:
    Sedan (FB2)
    Agree with Nix.
    You will surely enjoy your civic with some performance mods such as good tires, lighter rims, good suspension, sway bar, better brakes, etc.
    Putting a super / turbo charger is giving you faster speed in straight line only, with about 5 car lane max. But you will miss the better handling and cornering.

    In my opinion, I may do a full bolt-on with tuned on my r18 than going with sc or turbo. With that $, I still can get some performance mods. That will net me a quick car. I don't need my civic as fast as SI but quick enough for some good acceleration.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2016
  6. Kylesn52

    Kylesn52 Member

    Messages:
    9
    Location:
    Toronto Ontario
    Vehicle Model:
    EX
    Body Style:
    Sedan
    Thanks Nix. My EX is a manual. Thanks for the information. I do understand where JR is coming from not wanting people to chop apart their vehicles.

    I currently don't have any performance mods. Cosmetic mostly. I do have eibach lowering springs (I may switch to coils but don't want to drive on coils in the winter), 235/45/17 tires, a 3 inch stainless straight pipe exhaust (probably doesn't add any power considering im still catted and not tuned) K&N drop in filter (doesn't do anything) and OE brakes. Other than that, I haven't bothered putting money into power gains because I didn't know they had a Flash pro for the 2012+ R18 until recently.
    If I can add decent power figures without going forced induction that would be great but there doesn't seem to be much out there for the 9th gen R18.

    How much power can be pushed out of an r18 with just bolt ons and a tune?
    For example say I did a high flow cat, CAI, TBS, and flash pro. What other mods are out there for the 9th gen r18? I'm not exactly looking to beat Si's but just enhance acceleration and add some pep to my car. Forced induction just seems like a good way to add lots of high end power and torque. I saw a turbo kit for $1500 online (I think it was for an 8th gen anyway so I'm still not sure if it is compatible, but could likely be converted for less than an additional $500). Considering I would not be running any more than 9 pounds, I don't think I would have to worry very much about blowing a cheap turbo and I would only expect to be around 200 hp.

    Trading to an Si is an option. The big thing for me ins insurance though. My EX is bad enough. An 18 year old male in Canada with an Si is like a dream customer to an insurance company. Definitely cant afford to pay for an si until I'm done college in a couple years. Hate to admit it but the smartest thing to do would be to wait and then trade up or trade in for a newer model year or finance the type R.
     
    r18-power, Nix and Tak like this.
  7. Nix

    Nix Jötunn Moderator

    Messages:
    10,765
    Location:
    Lew-vul, KY
    Body Style:
    It's A Fast Pig!
    Well since you have the MT, which is a huge advantage I would say you should really go with the Jackson TrackPack setup. You'll be able to get around 240hp max. I would stay away from "inexpensive" turbo kits as they tend to need a lot of work, fabrication, and end up costing more in the long run.

    With just bolt-ons I have seen NA R18's make just over 150whp. That was on an MT car with an aggressive custom cam as well. Hitting the 150's is possible but that's really about it without custom parts. One of the big bottlenecks is the intake manifold. Weapon-R did make an IM for the 06-11 cars that should fit yours but it was hard to find and pretty expensive at around $500.

    Turbo Issues: This is where that $1500 kit becomes a black hole of money and despair.....

    1) MAF sensor. It maxes out around 9-10psi. So guys hitting 190whp @7-8psi are pretty close to the limit for what the stock setup can do. At 8-9psi you need to switch to a MAP sensor.

    2) The stock plastic intake manifold breaks at around 17-18psi. Boost spikes will happen especially with an AT car so you will need to keep your boost in check very carefully unless you are willing to pay for a custom new IM.

    3) The stock engine should be run with no more than 17psi because the stock sleeves around the pistons are slightly oval shaped. Under serious power the piston can move more than it should which means you are going to need to send the block out to be sleeved, which should also mean you need new forged internals, pistons, rods, and at that point you will be needing valve train upgrades as well.

    4) Switching to a MAP sensor is not just a plug and play deal. If it is the same on the 9th gen then the IAT sensor is part of the MAF sensor and wiring. So you cannot just bolt on a Hondata 4 bar MAP sensor, they do make one for R18s, unless you are willing to separate and splice out that particular wire. You can also run the RDX sensor which reads up to 22psi-ish and be able to set flashpro to speed density and possibly run more than 10psi on your kit.

    5)You are going to need custom piping run and custom parts made if you want the kit to work well and you are not buying a complete FullRace setup. Vent to atmosphere does not run well on this particular car so you will need to make sure that the BOV is a recirculate setup. Your MAF sensor need to be pre-turbo like the EVO and Subi setups are and the recirc fitting from the recirc valve needs to go inbetween the MAF sensor and the turbo. More custom work.

    6) To get into the mid 200's you will need expensive custom work in the form of a new IM, custom DP, custom upgraded charge pipe sizes, really good turbo manifold, large intake, usually requires a battery relocate, and a few other things.



    My recommendation: Buy the Jackson Track kit and be done with a simple setup that works. Supporting mods like the IM and a nice "down pipe/header" should put you in the mid 200's but again, you are going to be looking at $5k easy.
     
  8. Nix

    Nix Jötunn Moderator

    Messages:
    10,765
    Location:
    Lew-vul, KY
    Body Style:
    It's A Fast Pig!
    Also, I'm not trying to talk you out of anything. If you want to go turbo/SC with your car - DO IT! I think a supercharged R18 running right around 200whp would be pretty nice.

    I just want you to have the full story and be prepared going in. The R18 is a great economy engine but it fights you all the way when you try to make power.
     
    Banshik, Ron Flood, webby and 2 others like this.
  9. Tak

    Tak Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    615
    Location:
    New York City
    Vehicle Model:
    LX
    Body Style:
    Sedan (FB2)
    Thank you @Nix for a detailed information.
    I, as a r18 guy, appreciate your information as well.
    Thank you
     
    r18-power and Nix like this.
  10. r18-power

    r18-power Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,251
    Location:
    FL
    Vehicle Model:
    Focus ST
    Body Style:
    Hatchback
    I had a turbo 8th gen R18, it had full bolt ons and a tsi extreme turbo kit tuned by Vit. I was making about 210 hp with a weapon R manifold, custom catless dp and 3" exhaust, it was fun and reliable but there is something about my Si that I like a lot more. Don't get me wrong you could make some Si owners sad when you beat them, why don't you try that kit? Im not sure if it would work on the 9th gen.
     
    Nix likes this.
  11. Jake LXer

    Jake LXer Jaykwabee and the R18

    Messages:
    497
    Location:
    New York
    Vehicle Model:
    civic
    Body Style:
    sedan
    I'll give you fitment updates in about 2 weeks when I'm finished installing mine, i've got a LX manual trans so it will be the same
     
    Ron Flood, Nix, Tak and 1 other person like this.
  12. webby
    • Staff
    • 2019 Toys For Tots

    webby Administrator

    Messages:
    51,587
    You're buying it?
     
  13. Tak

    Tak Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    615
    Location:
    New York City
    Vehicle Model:
    LX
    Body Style:
    Sedan (FB2)
    It looks like it. This helps r18 platform tremendously :)
     
  14. Gixxerfool

    Gixxerfool Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    201
    Location:
    Where the weak are killed and eaten
    Vehicle Model:
    Civic
    Body Style:
    Coupe EX
    I definitely appreciate this info @Nix it pretty much will save me a ton of money since for me the power gains aren't worth the investment. I'll enjoy my 30-ish miles to gallon while drinking my coffee and having my tinnitus further escalated.
     
    Ron Flood, ron v and Nix like this.
  15. Jake LXer

    Jake LXer Jaykwabee and the R18

    Messages:
    497
    Location:
    New York
    Vehicle Model:
    civic
    Body Style:
    sedan
    @webby i bought it and it's in my garage, the motor is ready to be pulled to build internals just waiting on parts
     
    Kylesn52, Ron Flood, Nix and 4 others like this.
  16. webby
    • Staff
    • 2019 Toys For Tots

    webby Administrator

    Messages:
    51,587
    really looking forward to seeing how it goes for you
     
  17. Tak

    Tak Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    615
    Location:
    New York City
    Vehicle Model:
    LX
    Body Style:
    Sedan (FB2)
    Please take pictures as it progresses. It really helps all r18 guys.
    Thank you so much
     
    Kylesn52 likes this.
  18. r18-power

    r18-power Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,251
    Location:
    FL
    Vehicle Model:
    Focus ST
    Body Style:
    Hatchback
    Yeah post pics, im not an r18 guy anymore but im excited to see the end result
     
  19. Jake LXer

    Jake LXer Jaykwabee and the R18

    Messages:
    497
    Location:
    New York
    Vehicle Model:
    civic
    Body Style:
    sedan
    I will do my best to take pictures i always forget but the rumors are true it is not a direct bolt-on there is custom work to be done especially with the previously stated issue with the crash bar i had to shave off a good amount for the intercooler, i thought of getting a thinner or shorter intercooler but i just figured this car will most likely never be daily-ed again so structure of this part isn't as important to me as someone who will daily it.
     
    Tak likes this.
  20. Tak

    Tak Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    615
    Location:
    New York City
    Vehicle Model:
    LX
    Body Style:
    Sedan (FB2)
    Since you bought the sc kits and you already noticed the issue, I would try to find a workaround to make the intercooler fit without shaving off the crash bar. Shaving off the crash bar may stop other r18 guys from doing the same project if their r18 is a daily but want to boost a bit. Your skills and mechanical knowledge would be able to find a workaround that help other r18 guys.
    Thank you so much :)
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2016
    r18-power likes this.

Share This Page