2nd gear diagnosis

M

mugensi

Well-Known Member
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38
Hey guys so ever since I put my new exhaust on have been hitting vtec for the past 4 days. I just love the sound and I can't help but floor it. Well I had discovered something very interesting, when I go from 1st gear to second gear (shifting at 7k rpm) I heard a pretty light grinding noise. Well this noise is consistent when I shift that high so I consulted a few buddies and they said that I may be shifting to quickly and not letting the clutch grab enough. So I decided to take the advice and when I shift at 7k I have to let the clutch off pretty slow or it will grind. Has anyone else experienced this before? It's like I have to baby going from 1st to second gear that high of an rpm. Any one experience this?

Side note guys it never grinds when shifting normal. It honestly doesn't even grind at 5k rpm from 1st to 2nd. It only does it when I hit vtect in first to second if I don't let the clutch out kind of slow. Is it just driver error guys or what? I searched the forums and it seems that ALOT of the 8th gens have this problem. I have a 2012 honda civic si coupe. I am still somewhat new to driving stick. My car has 4600 miles on it now and I got in late october.
 
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if you're grinding gears... I'm guessing you're either forcing it into 2nd before you've got the clutch fully depressed? Or, you're lifting up on the clutch before it's fully in 2nd. The grinding you feel... you're feeling in the shifter itself, or in the clutch pedal, or?
 
I honestly don't know. I would say I feel it in the clutch pedal.
 
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You said it yourself, it works fine except when you shift too fast from 1st to 2nd while not allowing it to sync. Work with it and when you find it shifts without grinding then work on doing it that way all the time. Comes with practice.
 
Happens to me too. Even at normal rpm. I have to kind of just put pressure in the shifter as I'm going into second and kind of let it fall in gear lol. That and slowing the 1-2 shift has helped a ton. But like I said mine still does it at low rpm in first, second, and sometimes third. More so when its cold. Mine is very slight. Almost feels like its just catching the gear when I'm first entering the gear and I can feel it in the shifter. All this is with the clutch fully depressed. Also tried without pressing the clutch all the way in, same thing. I just attributed it to being a manual, even if the reviews praise this transmission.
 
Never happened to me at high rpms, I've shifted from 1st to 2nd at redline a couple times and never had grinding, but I've experienced it when I'm driving slow and get lazy when shifting. I'll let out the clutch too soon without realizing it cause I'm tired and then I'll feel it grind. Maybe you're doing the same thing just very quickly?
 
We all can miss a shift, basically. I've seen quite a few on here that are having shifting problems, and in most cases it comes down to the driver being new at using a straight stick, and trannys like any mechanical devise will have small variances. It's up to the human to learn how to make it work correctly.
Just in this thread alone there are variances between the post, I'd recommend just working with each of yours.

Bulkybear made a good point about using pressure touch shifting...... Getting the shifter in place to the point where it's as close to actually doing it, but not yet, at this point, touch the clutch enough to where the gear will almost fall into place(because of your pressure with your hand, and it will "slip" into place).

Also that's the same way to use a clutch "Pressure pushing the pedal"........ Just feel the clutch under your foot where it is at the point of disengaging, but not. Then having the gear in pressure place at the same time your clutch is in pressure place............. Then push both at the same time, and that's a perfect shift, if something goes wrong it's us, not the tranny.

Also this works for MC's and heavy equipment......Semi's in my case..........Although with semi's there's what we call double clutching, what we're doing there is the same thing as I explained above, but the added step is to do it to go into neutral and again to go to the next gear................

Practice ..... and you won't be a "Gear Jammer" but a technician.
 
Agreed with everything you said monk. My particular issue, if that's what you want to call it, isn't necessarily grinding a gear. It's the fact that I can feel the gear catch as it is engaging through the shifter. I just chalk it up to being a manual. Nothing grinds or feels like I'm doing anything wrong though. And its pretty noticeable when the tranny is cold. Much better after its warmed up. Could be just the thick gear oil. It's something that I notice, but I don't put much thought into it because it doesn't feel abnormal. It's moving gears, it seems logical you are going to feel those things. Higher quality transmission fluid would probably clear it right up tbh.
 
This always happens to me when shifting at high rpms in my 03 accord. When I went through diesel school and we were learning about transmission I brought this up. My teach suggested that maybe the second gear synchro was starting to go. It makes sense kind of. I don't know if this is correct but I haven't had this problem in my si yet. Hope this helps
 
I don't call it grinding either(but for the lack of a better word and not to confuse the issue with semantics)........... It's like you say, when you put two gears together they can be at any ready point of contact and if they aren't lined up, they are going to push/slide/roll/bump/etc. till they are in place and that will some times make a noise, or sometime feel rough, just depending on if they are lined up tip to tip or off set from TTT .
 
Monk said:
I don't call it grinding either(but for the lack of a better word and not to confuse the issue with semantics)........... It's like you say, when you put two gears together they can be at any ready point of contact and if they aren't lined up, they are going to push/slide/roll/bump/etc. till they are in place and that will some times make a noise, or sometime feel rough, just depending on if they are lined up tip to tip or off set from TTT .
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But these are synchronized transmissions. That should completely eliminate that problem. It's strange that it is repetitive.
 
Brooksie 365 said:
This always happens to me when shifting at high rpms in my 03 accord. When I went through diesel school and we were learning about transmission I brought this up. My teach suggested that maybe the second gear synchro was starting to go. It makes sense kind of. I don't know if this is correct but I haven't had this problem in my si yet. Hope this helps
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Yes that can happen(synchro) with time, That's one of the reasons to shift properly and it will save the syncros as well as the gears.......

The way I (and Bulkybear) explained pressure clutching/& shifting...... with a MC there aren't any syncros yet with PS it will still slide together smoothly. And old cars didn't even have syncros(which I've driven in my younger days).
 
Brooksie365 said:
But these are synchronized transmissions. That should completely eliminate that problem. It's strange that it is repetitive.
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I'm not going to say you're wrong, but to a degree. The syncros are there to help this transition but only to some degree, that's why going from 1st to 2nd is usually the culprit, due to the smaller 1st & the larger 2nd, were as with going from 2 thru 6 seems more smoother because they are closer in size, so when moving from one to another there isn't as much of a jump. As I said above I drove cars without syncros, and wish they had them for ppl to learn on now days, then they'd understand a lot better how to shift.

Ppl can jam the gears and let the syncros do all the work, but it will wear them out as well.
 
Monk said:
The syncros are there to help this transition but only to some degree, that's why going from 1st to 2nd is usually the culprit, due to the smaller 1st & the larger 2nd, were as with going from 2 thru 6 seems more smoother because they are closer in size, so when moving from one to another there isn't as much of a jump.
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That's a good point. I have honestly never taken a car transmission apart. I have only taken apart tractor trailer ones. They are very close to get the load moving. What you say makes 100% sense. I just had to look a little out side of my very thick walled box.
 
Brooksie365 said:
Yes of course I understand that. With research a lot of people with 8th gens have gotten there 2 gear and synchro changed. Some say it worked some say it did not. I stumbled across this I'm not sure if this carries over to our gen of cars I'm sure some one will be able to tell us. http://www.8thcivic.com/forums/transmission/203074-diy-2nd-gear-grind-fix-clutch-adjust.html
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Couldn't agree more, if the clutch slave needs adjustment, by all means get the best adjustment we can get.

Just don't forget that with PS it will work the same with or without adjustment, unless it's so far out of adjustment that the car want's to keep moving even though the clutch is engaged, from a standing start. But again, if it not adjusted correctly, it would be well worth doing the adjustment.
 
Brooksie365 said:
That's a good point. I have honestly never taken a car transmission apart. I have only taken apart tractor trailer ones. They are very close to get the load moving. What you say makes 100% sense. I just had to look a little out side of my very thick walled box.
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For the peeps reading this, you bring up a good point..... That's why semi's have so many gears, so they don't have big steps at any gear change.
 
Brooksie365 said:
Yes of course I understand that. With research a lot of people with 8th gens have gotten there 2 gear and synchro changed. Some say it worked some say it did not. I stumbled across this I'm not sure if this carries over to our gen of cars I'm sure some one will be able to tell us. http://www.8thcivic.com/forums/transmission/203074-diy-2nd-gear-grind-fix-clutch-adjust.html
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I think I read they fixed the 2nd and 3rd gear issues by the 2009 model year. Either way like I said I can feel the gears catch sometimes, I.dont think its an issue though. It's a manual transmission, the gears aren't always going to line up perfectly and synchros can only help so much. I have a warranty on my car so ill take it in of it gets worse, but for now ill just chalk it up to being a manual.
 
I have ground second a couple times while shifting at redline, it only seems to happen when I am not really paying attention or I try and grab second while the tires are spinning. I know it sounds like I'm a dummy, but whenever I actually pay attention to shifting at high rpms it doesn't grind. I figured i just wasn't pushing the clutch in far enough before shifting, or it was because of the rev hang. I know it probably doesn't have anything to do with the hang, but i like to blame everything on that. :rotfl:
 
That's exactly what is was cubert. I just wasn't paying attention lol. I havn't ground since :P
 
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