Amazon, Mobil 1 & Valvoline Oil Compared

[webby]

I know some 8th gen si owners set theirs between 8600-9000 for fuel cut without issue. Others upgraded springs to go 9500 fuel cut.

 

[Bruce Bartlow]

I believe the factory fuel cut is at 7,200? @webby

I normally shift a little early around 7,200-7,500

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Yes, i think so too @mySIck ...7,200 is stock, and therefore conservative. Honda doesn't want to be buying a bunch of new engines while still under warranty, right? Yet I think most would agree there's a little wiggle room above 7,200. Question is how much. I recommend enjoying yourself (that's why we buy these cars) with a level of discretion that has a "safety first" mind set, followed by the ability of your pocketbook to withstand large losses.

Consider my own thought process of a common driving tactic "in the field":

-- You approach a vehicle that is losing speed as you both begin ascending a hill. You need to pass while you can. Coast is clear.

-- You drop to 3rd and slow to the speed of the vehicle ahead, keeping revs around 6,000, drafting while you wait to pop out. Turn headlights on. Position the left tires near the center line. Let the driver ahead know of your intentions. He might make it easier for you by veering to the right.

-- Take one last peek, putting 2 tires just over the line if necessary to get a good look at oncoming traffic, if any.

-- If clear apply WOT, building revs and speed. Pop out fully. Reassess. You can still change your mind.

-- Commit more fully but never completely. Always know you can back off and return to your lane. Have a What-If plan. And never pass before a corner no matter how far away you think it is. "Closing speeds" could approach 180mph in this exercise, the speed it takes to cross a football field in ~3 seconds. (@webby will get me the exact time, i just know it)

-- 3rd gear revs will approach 7,200 as the vehicle reaches a theoretical max of 71mph. This will happen in a matter of seconds.
https://www.automobile-catalog.com/performance/2012/1600655/honda_civic_si_coupe.html

-- Depending on the speed of the other vehicle, you might need to hold WOT for 2 more seconds for a run to 7600 - 7800. That's where the extra redline comes in handy. 4th gear is okay, but 3rd is Beast Mode. 3rd also provides much better engine braking, should you need it.

-- Power Shift into 4th (no wait... "shift into 4th without hesitation"... sounds better) holding strong revs ~6,000. Power continues to build but not like it did in Beast Mode.

-- Being a courteous driver (haha) and not wanting to cut off the other car immediately, you continue WOT until you reach triple digit territory. (To be completely clear the other vehicle of course) Or maybe you just forgot. Considering that max 4th gear speed is only 101 that's about all the fun you're going to have. Because 5th is a dog. You need forever to get up to its 126 max.

-- So... knowing that you're about to lose precious torque and probably your precious license, you return to normal driving speeds. But at least you can look for another car to pass.


___________

 

[Bruce Bartlow]

Yeah, 7200 is supposedly oem limit without flashpro/ktuner.

Bruce, bobistheoilguy has threads where they’ve said wix and amsoil had some identical metal stamping even inside. They claimed Donaldson was making the synthetic media for amsoil, but the casing was from wix assembly.

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Yep, that's what i'm seeing too. Looks like I forgot to post the other comparison picture of Amsoil and WIX.
Suffice it to say I believe Amsoil makes the better filters right now. What we don't know if how close the WIX media is to the Amsoil's.

Thanks for digging into this webby.

 

[Bruce Bartlow]

Here's the Amsoil next to the Wix from a different perspective:

 

[webby]

Bruce -

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kx-NT1DEtlU

 

[webby]

Napa grades

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1B_hWb5mCCg

 

[Bruce Bartlow]

The question remains... what's the efficiency at each particular micron level. All other analysis is superficial... or addresses only the basic construction of the filter.

 

[webby]

On the Bosch, f you carefully at their claim of "99%" efficiency (it's on the box) you'll notice there's no micron level attached to it. So the 99% is meaningless.

On the contrary, Amsoil uses the 15 micron level... which is a very high bar for a full flow filter.

from the bosch website -

• A high glass content is woven into the blended media, providing greater efficiency and strength by trapping 99% of the particulates from getting into the engine

*Based on ISO 4548-12 at 20 microns on 3500


"3323" is the si model bosch filter model.

d3323 is the bosch distance plus filter and it's rated 40 microns.
3343 bosch premium is rated 20 microns.

 

[webby]

mobil 1 extended m1-110 filter

Keeps oil cleaner, longer – 99%+ efficiency*
• Synthetic blend media keeps oil cleaner and holds more dirt†

*Efficiency rating based on removing particles greater than 30 microns

 

[webby]

the fram ultra synthetic 20k mile
XG7317

2-ply synthetic, metal-screen-reinforced media provides 99%+ filtration efficiency.*
*FRAM Group testing of average filter efficiency of PH8A, 3387A and 4967 or equivalent FRAM TG or EG models under ISO 4548-12 for particles greater than 20 microns.

their tough guard filter also claims 20 microns on the same iso test. 99%+. The standard filter is saying 95% at 20 micron.

 

[Bruce Bartlow]

mobil 1 extended m1-110 filter

Keeps oil cleaner, longer – 99%+ efficiency*
• Synthetic blend media keeps oil cleaner and holds more dirt†

*Efficiency rating based on removing particles greater than 30 microns

______________
So the M1 extended filter captures only those particles that are fully twice the size (micron level) of the Amsoil test. In other words, it's half as good in that respect. If that's the only determinant of a good filter. Seems to me the Amsoil filter will fill up faster too.... unless it has greater overall capacity.

To my earlier point, what a filter really needs to address is where engine wear occurs -- between 3 - 10 microns. Larger particulate matter doesn't matter because it doesn't get wedged in between the parts, smaller particulars aren't abrasive at all... it's like they don't exist, though they might contaminate the oil generally.

There's a size that's most important to engine wear.. and that's what bypass filtration addresses.

https://www.amsoil.com/newsstand/diesel/articles/amsoil-two-million-mile-truck-story/

 

[Bruce Bartlow]

the fram ultra synthetic 20k mile
XG7317

2-ply synthetic, metal-screen-reinforced media provides 99%+ filtration efficiency.*
*FRAM Group testing of average filter efficiency of PH8A, 3387A and 4967 or equivalent FRAM TG or EG models under ISO 4548-12 for particles greater than 20 microns.

their tough guard filter also claims 20 microns on the same iso test. 99%+. The standard filter is saying 95% at 20 micron.

__________
Now we're getting somewhere.

 

[Bruce Bartlow]

FRAM has had such a horrible reputation. This is damage control.

 

[Bruce Bartlow]

"Racing" filters are worse. Since they need to maintain full flow at high RPM and high pressure, they need to make their filters more porous. "Heavy duty", sure... physically speaking. But check out the specs of any of the racing filters and you'll notice a distinct move to 40 microns and beyond. In other words, their prime function is not as a filter.

 

[webby]

FRAM has had such a horrible reputation. This is damage control.

at least the ultra construction looks a lot better. I know I've seen videos from the early 2000's and the fram filters looked pretty bad on the inside with a lot of cardboard material. Looks like the 2 lower models still use some form of cardboard material. The ultra filter for the si is showing $9.42 on walmart's site for me currently.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y544o-mw2wc

 

[sunofwolf]

Well its good to know that the Honda engine exceeds specs even, I would like to see a Dyno run going to 8,000. Post up video, someone must have done this. What makes honda engines hold up at that rpm? I can't even find out what the engine block is made out of or other internal parts-seems to be hidden.

 

[sunofwolf]

at least the ultra construction looks a lot better. I know I've seen videos from the early 2000's and the fram filters looked pretty bad on the inside with a lot of cardboard material. Looks like the 2 lower models still use some form of cardboard material. The ultra filter for the si is showing $9.42 on walmart's site for me currently.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y544o-mw2wc

The thing about Fram makes me not buy them now is their shady reputation-this has not gone away. Very Bad Quality control.

 

[mySIck]

Well its good to know that the Honda engine exceeds specs even, I would like to see a Dyno run going to 8,000. Post up video, someone must have done this. What makes honda engines hold up at that rpm? I can't even find out what the engine block is made out of or other internal parts-seems to be hidden.

Right off the show room floor it is not worth pushing the fuel cut to 8k you will lose power at 7000 RPMs. I am sure I can find a video of someone with stock internals. I am sure most people do E-tuning so it makes it hard to find some dyno results some time.

 

[mySIck]

@sunofwolf and what do you mean by can't find what the block is made of and internals? Are you looking for the parts list?

 

[mySIck]

A little mix of TSX once I get off from work tonight I'll find some better ones.