The official "Ask a Detailer Thread"

Nomar06 said:
Probably need to do a multi step detail to get rid of the swirls. Use some cutting compounds(depending on how bad the swirls are), then polish and wax/seal it all up.
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Yeah I have done some extensive details, but have not ever done corrective work. I really want to educate on it first, and then get to work so I can get this crap out. I am very good at detailing, I just have never actually taken the time to learn paint correction.
 
Nix said:
You will need fine polish and soft pads. The Honda paint is pretty soft and black tends to be the softest out there. (most of the time)

Multi-step if you really want that paint to shine. Try a Meguiars 205 / white pad combo and then after use an even finer polish like a Menzerna FF3000 or SF4000 on a black or red finishing pad.

The 205/white is a great combo for most OEM paint. It should take care of the majority of the swirls but black paints are finicky and hard to finish down perfectly, hence needing a second finishing step.

@ClearCutSi is a far better detailer than I. He may have another suggestion.
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Thanks @Nix! Any recommend on equipment as far as buffer?
 
hehehe, what's your budget?

There will be a ton of sales coming up with black friday so if you can wait until then you can score some great package deals.

The Griots 6" DA is a good choice for a budget buffer. I have the PC7424 but I felt like it didn't have enough oomph for 5.5" pads and i use it with 3"/4" pads and it works great.

The newer Meguiars MT300 looks really nice and is just slightly more than the Griots or Porter Cable units but without crossing into professional price territory.

If budget isn't a concern the Rupes products are the current "best" buffers out there. Flex make a nice product too. hahah basically you can't go wrong but look into the Meguiars MT300.

Meguiars:
http://www.detailedimage.com/Meguiars-M43/MT300-Dual-Action-Polisher-P966/


Griots:
http://www.detailedimage.com/Griots-M56/Random-Orbital-Polisher-P671/6-S1/
 
Nix said:
hehehe, what's your budget?

There will be a ton of sales coming up with black friday so if you can wait until then you can score some great package deals.

The Griots 6" DA is a good choice for a budget buffer. I have the PC7424 but I felt like it didn't have enough oomph for 5.5" pads and i use it with 3"/4" pads and it works great.

The newer Meguiars MT300 looks really nice and is just slightly more than the Griots or Porter Cable units but without crossing into professional price territory.

If budget isn't a concern the Rupes products are the current "best" buffers out there. Flex make a nice product too. hahah basically you can't go wrong but look into the Meguiars MT300.

Meguiars:
http://www.detailedimage.com/Meguiars-M43/MT300-Dual-Action-Polisher-P966/


Griots:
http://www.detailedimage.com/Griots-M56/Random-Orbital-Polisher-P671/6-S1/
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Heck yeah man, thanks!
 
:D
cbae73267ec0dc5f375ee3cd406f5227.jpg


Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk
 
Dennis Rockholt said:
Yeah I have done some extensive details, but have not ever done corrective work. I really want to educate on it first, and then get to work so I can get this crap out. I am very good at detailing, I just have never actually taken the time to learn paint correction.
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the best for swirls is using A. a really good swirl remover at 1000rpms and just go nice and slow or B. Get a nice Da and run over some good swirl remover. Paint Correction is a SUPER pain but just takes a lot of time and patience. As far as good buffers I Got my nice Dewalt buffer for less than 200$ but unless you get good pads or good product then it can become a nightmare. Rupes is great for a da expensive but well worth it. One of my favorites ive ever used but, with that being said anything half decent da wise will do what you need it to do. I did a few S2000's when I worked at a Honda dealer the black one took me awhile I think I spent 3 hrs total between wetsanding buffing and swirl removing but the outcome was more than amazing.
 
TF_FB6 said:
the best for swirls is using A. a really good swirl remover at 1000rpms and just go nice and slow or B. Get a nice Da and run over some good swirl remover. Paint Correction is a SUPER pain but just takes a lot of time and patience. As far as good buffers I Got my nice Dewalt buffer for less than 200$ but unless you get good pads or good product then it can become a nightmare. Rupes is great for a da expensive but well worth it. One of my favorites ive ever used but, with that being said anything half decent da wise will do what you need it to do. I did a few S2000's when I worked at a Honda dealer the black one took me awhile I think I spent 3 hrs total between wetsanding buffing and swirl removing but the outcome was more than amazing.
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Okay great, so get a decent buffer and then basically a swirl remover, and full polish set and I will definitely be meticulous as I am OCD to the max when it comes to this stuff
 
Prep is extremely important. Chemical and mechanical decontamination first.

Strip the car with a strong soap first. Then use something like CarPro IronX to dissolve a lot of the hidden contaminates. It will be hard to see on a black car but using that stuff will get rid of a lot of just below the surface imperfections. Iron filings and things that are stuck into the paint. Clay bar is essential. Using a fallout remover like IronX speeds up clay time tremendously.

I made the switch to a polymer mitt and the time savings alone are worth the cost. Clay still has a place for small jobs and tight corners.

You'll then need an assortment of pads and polish compounds. Meguiars 105/205 with orange/white/black pads can handle just about anything. For soft black paint you'll still need a finishing step with a very fine finishing compound and a black/red pad.

Between polishing steps you will need to remove the previous compound. Use diluted isopropyl alcohol or CarPro make a special fluid called Eraser that will remove any residue. Make sure you get any residue off the paint before you wax/seal. I like Eraser cause it works well and it smells good. I also don't trust myself to remember to dilute the IPA enough and I would rather spend an extra $$ to not have sagging paint from IPA damage. Rare but eh, better safe than sorry with this stuff.



(edit: pad colors refer to Lake Country pads. The plain regular 5.5" foam ones. They make other lines as well so just be aware "white" means LC classic white.)
 
Nix said:
Prep is extremely important. Chemical and mechanical decontamination first.

Strip the car with a strong soap first. Then use something like CarPro IronX to dissolve a lot of the hidden contaminates. It will be hard to see on a black car but using that stuff will get rid of a lot of just below the surface imperfections. Iron filings and things that are stuck into the paint. Clay bar is essential. Using a fallout remover like IronX speeds up clay time tremendously.

I made the switch to a polymer mitt and the time savings alone are worth the cost. Clay still has a place for small jobs and tight corners.

You'll then need an assortment of pads and polish compounds. Meguiars 105/205 with orange/white/black pads can handle just about anything. For soft black paint you'll still need a finishing step with a very fine finishing compound and a black/red pad.

Between polishing steps you will need to remove the previous compound. Use diluted isopropyl alcohol or CarPro make a special fluid called Eraser that will remove any residue. Make sure you get any residue off the paint before you wax/seal. I like Eraser cause it works well and it smells good. I also don't trust myself to remember to dilute the IPA enough and I would rather spend an extra $$ to not have sagging paint from IPA damage. Rare but eh, better safe than sorry with this stuff.



(edit: pad colors refer to Lake Country pads. The plain regular 5.5" foam ones. They make other lines as well so just be aware "white" means LC classic white.)
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20161007_181147.jpg IMG_20161007_183848.jpg IMG_20161007_185409.jpg
Well I went through and did a full foam touchless wash, then regular wash with micro mit, then brought it in the garage for full clay, then meguires ultimate compound, ultimate polish, chemical guys butter wet wax, and then chemical guys jet seal. Results were great.
 
Also, I feel this is noteworthy, the paint on this car is Original to the car. 2003 haha so its pretty impressive granted how soft Berlina Black really is
 
webby said:
Great results you got there!
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Thanks! I used a ryobi random orbital to apply the compound, but the polish results were much better when done by hand since I could not mess with the speeds. this was my first time ever doing anything to this level so I was extremely happy.
 
Nix said:
Prep is extremely important. Chemical and mechanical decontamination first.

Strip the car with a strong soap first. Then use something like CarPro IronX to dissolve a lot of the hidden contaminates. It will be hard to see on a black car but using that stuff will get rid of a lot of just below the surface imperfections. Iron filings and things that are stuck into the paint. Clay bar is essential. Using a fallout remover like IronX speeds up clay time tremendously.

I made the switch to a polymer mitt and the time savings alone are worth the cost. Clay still has a place for small jobs and tight corners.

You'll then need an assortment of pads and polish compounds. Meguiars 105/205 with orange/white/black pads can handle just about anything. For soft black paint you'll still need a finishing step with a very fine finishing compound and a black/red pad.

Between polishing steps you will need to remove the previous compound. Use diluted isopropyl alcohol or CarPro make a special fluid called Eraser that will remove any residue. Make sure you get any residue off the paint before you wax/seal. I like Eraser cause it works well and it smells good. I also don't trust myself to remember to dilute the IPA enough and I would rather spend an extra $$ to not have sagging paint from IPA damage. Rare but eh, better safe than sorry with this stuff.



(edit: pad colors refer to Lake Country pads. The plain regular 5.5" foam ones. They make other lines as well so just be aware "white" means LC classic white.)
Click to expand...
______________________
Fortunately, most pad manufacturers use the same color scheme.
If you haven't seen it, Chemical Guys posted a video about the various pads here:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFnmfn9mwYc


P.S. For general cutting and polishing it's hard to beat the versatility of an orange pad.
 
Bruce Bartlow said:
______________________
Fortunately, most pad manufacturers use the same color scheme.
If you haven't seen it, Chemical Guys posted a video about the various pads here:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFnmfn9mwYc


P.S. For general cutting and polishing it's hard to beat the versatility of an orange pad.
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Chemical guys for the most part, is all I use. I am a huge fan of most of their products, and some others I do not care for at all. They have great soaps etc for your upper-class everyday detailer. I do not like to use their stuff for more challenging things like polishing or buffing. They did however just come out with a scratch correction product I would like to give a try though.
 
Thanks @Nix for mentioning me. I am certainly late to the mix here as I am busy with the business (I need to log on more often)

I am glad the original post person got good results. I would have tackled it a little different because I have done over a dozen S2Ks, but as long as he is happy that's all that matters. For future correction I would recommend to get spot lighting so you can see the area you are working with (The picture you posted of after shows ambient lighting) and can correct further or do a second pass if needed with better results. RPM on the machine can go a little higher to get cleaner results. Ambient lighting is great for final steps so that you can see what it will look like in the sun or to make sure you remove high spots from coatings.

Either way, if you need more advice for the future, just post up.
 
ClearCutSi said:
Thanks @Nix for mentioning me. I am certainly late to the mix here as I am busy with the business (I need to log on more often)

I am glad the original post person got good results. I would have tackled it a little different because I have done over a dozen S2Ks, but as long as he is happy that's all that matters. For future correction I would recommend to get spot lighting so you can see the area you are working with (The picture you posted of after shows ambient lighting) and can correct further or do a second pass if needed with better results. RPM on the machine can go a little higher to get cleaner results. Ambient lighting is great for final steps so that you can see what it will look like in the sun or to make sure you remove high spots from coatings.

Either way, if you need more advice for the future, just post up.
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Great, I really appreciate you reaching out. I actually drove it today so I will get another pic of it in the direct sunlight, but there are still some swirls I see (not nearly as bad though). I plan on getting an actually griots or some other brand buffer and going back over it in the near future..this was my very first time doing anything of the sort, so I was happy but I definitely would like to improve upon said results. :wigglesmiley:
 
Meguiars 105/205 would really take care of it if you want to get rid of more imperfections. Ultimate compound is just pretty light compared to the 105/205.
 
After taking a look at it in the direct sunlight, it would seem much more work is going to be required. Granted, it looks so much better than it did, but there is still significant swirling all around. Would I wash, clay, then buff with the compounds/polishes, and then wax and seal again? This time I will use a multiple buff wheel process too. I am tempted to even wet sand...thoughts?
 
Washing with a dish soap would strip the wax off. That would be enough. Then go right to the m105.

Amazon product
View: https://www.amazon.com/Meguiars-Mirror-Glaze-Ultra-Cut-Compound/dp/B003LMGDHI


If you look through rasky'a thread you'll see he basically goes right to 105 when he does almost any paint correction. Some vehicles he's done didn't even look like their was clearcoat or much paint to speak of left on the car. After he did 105 to 205, the car was like it was better than a new paint job.
 
Not Bashing Meguiars because I still use their products but there are alot of other compounds out there that are a little easier to work than 105/205. For a Beginner you can also get into trouble with those products because of the cut power on them. What I have learned over the years is gradually work your way up ( by doing test spots) and find the combo that works for your paint. On my most recent S2K I went with Rupes Medium Quarz and finished it off with CarPro Essence. I would definitely recommend to do two steps on your black S2k because it tends to show everything. the Finishing Polish will remove those pesky little micro abrasions caused by the cut in the compound (No matter if its heavy or medium cut)

Chop top from Shine Supply(Heavy cut longer working time, Flat Top (Super fast cut less working time) S3xxl Gold from Scholl Concepts... List goes on...Your pad also makes a big difference, you get even a faster working product using Microfiber pads or a closed cell foam pad vs and open cell foam pad. Sorry if I make your head spin a little, but these are all things I think a bout as a detailer when assessing a job.

Keep in mind that when you removed the swirls you brought out the deeper imperfections which is why you're still noticing things on the finish. Also make sure you are using paint safe Microfibers, they are expensive, but when looking for that perfect result, they are worth the money.
 
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